Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected

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Offline Drew

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Non-towered airports can sometimes be a zoo----but I actually prefer them.  I have had several airplanes pull out onto the runway as I was rolling out on final.  Not that big of a deal for me---just add power and go around.  But guys who 1) don't listen on the radio and 2) don't look in the groove before they pull out on the runway may one day run out of their nine lives.  I think the guy figured out his mistake when I did a low pass offset from the runway.

Two weekends ago, I flew out to Ocean City, NJ.  The winds were favoring 24 (right traffic for this runway).  I called my crosswind leg when a Bonanza asked which runway was in use.  I called that I was turning downwind for 24.  He called entering a left 45 for 24.  I looked out the right side of the aircraft towards the opposite side of the pattern trying to look for him and called out that it was right traffic for 24.  The unicom also answered up that it was indeed right traffic for 24. My wife startled me by pointing out the front and saying to watch out.  The Bonanza was coming off the RIGHT 45 onto the downwind leg---right in front of my nose!  The Bonanza made a mistake----actually two mistakes which nearly had us swapping paint.  Usually you can get away with a mistake here and there---but when they add up at crucial moments, they can cost you your life.  He not only called off the wrong position----but when he intercepted the downwind leg, he was nowhere close to midfield---as a matter of fact, he was well past the approach numbers!  I was just about to turn base!  You don't need a radio to go to an untowered airport.  But sometimes, the radio just adds confusion.  When you go to non-towered airports, remain predictable.  Even if you have marbles in your mouth and can't seem to get out the right words, at least use standard pattern entrys.  I am not expecting to see someone come off the 45 near the base leg.  Also, the guy on downwind has the right of way---not the guy on the 45.

Other comm stuff for nontowered airports:
-Don't take the active---the rest of us need to use it!  Seriously though...it is a waste of time to say anything with the word "active" in it.  No one at a nontowered airport designates "the active" and for all of us 10 miles out trying to figure out which runway is in use it helps if I hear someone calling "Culpeper traffic, Cozy 123 taking off runway 4, Culpeper.  From this, I know the airport and the runway---and if I missed the very beginning part of the transmission, I do in fact know that we are talking about Culpeper airport.  Hearing that Cozy 123 is taking the active helps no one (what airport and what runway?)

-Position and hold---Why are people doing this at non-towered airports?  If you are not ready to go, don't get on the runway.  Last year, I saw a student pilot pull out onto the runway (position and hold) with a Kingair on final.  I had just landed with a Kingair following me.  I was rolling out when I heard the student pilot call that he was going to postion and hold.  At the time I thought---this is going to be interesting----1) I have a pet peeve about calling posit and hold at nontowered airports and 2) he just pulled out in front of the Kingair.  The Kingair pilot was understandably not happy---and gave the student a tongue lashing of sorts.  From the conversation that followed, the student did not understand that the Kingair was not allowed to overfly him and land on the remaining runway.  Oh well.  The lesson is, don't get on the runway until ready to go.  Even there was no one else in the pattern, just wait for the landing traffic to clear the runway.  You don't want to keep your back to the groove that long.  

Stay safe---we all make mistakes (on every flight).  It is the chain reaction of multiple mistakes that usually causes us harm.
Drew Swenson
Cozy N171ML

Offline Chairboy

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2006, 08:28:13 PM »
Good post, great advice.  

I'll be flying and I'll hear people call into approach or the tower saying "Casce approach, Cessna 1234 Tango with you."  For some reason, there's a bunch of people out there that have been taught that's "the thing" to say when being handed off.  The inevitable response is that tower or approach tells you altimeter and has you verify altitude.  If instead you said "Cascade approach, Cessna 1234 Tango at two thousand five hundred" you get it all taken care of in a single shot.

People calling into approach in general around here and in LA get into these long conversations when a little planning ahead of time would keep the frequency clear.  Here's a real radio conversation I heard:  "Cascade approach, request." "Aircraft calling, say request." "Cascade approach, request flight following."  "Aircraft calling, say tail number."  "Cascade approach, Cessna 1234 Tango."  "Cessna 1234 Tango, squawk 3201 and ident."  "Squawking 3201 and identing."  "Radar contact, 5 miles east Eugene airport.  Say destination and altitude."  "Cascade approach, Cessna 1234 Tango is going to PDX." and so on.

There's no reason to say 'Request', the tower and approach guys are trained in active listening.  And if they DO miss something important, they'll say something.   That same radio call could be made like this:  "Cascade approach, Cessna 1234 Tango, two miles north Creswell at two thousand five hundred, flight following to PDX."  That'd get rid of half of the radio calls and free up the frequency twice as fast.  

Anyhow, just sharing a rant.  Great points about expecting the unexpected too.

Offline NWade

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2006, 09:02:15 PM »
As I've stated numerous times here before, I'm a student pilot...  So take my comments with whatever weight you want.  

I've now got about 20 hours in my logbook and have been training in a tight airspace and a busy airport with lots of freight and corporate traffic -  KBFI (Boeing Field).  It is underneath the approach path & Class-B for SEA-TAC, just south of downtown Seattle, and 5 miles west of Renton.  I fly a lot in the evenings on weeknights - and usually end up doing T&G's in-between freight flights.  So one of the things I've had to really learn quickly is radio discipline!

The IFR bits are way over my head, and the man is a bit grumpy - but NOTHING has done more to prepare me mentally for the radio than Dan Brown's series of columns called "Say Again" over at www.avweb.com

http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182651-1.html

GREAT stuff!  The newer articles cover a lot of NATCA/FAA stuff; but his earlier work really highlights ATC-pilot relations and phraseology, as well as gives you a good idea of what's going through the minds of the ATC guys...  Enjoy!

Take care,

--Noel

Offline Jack

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #3 on: May 23, 2006, 03:30:16 AM »
Quote from: "Chairboy"

People calling into approach in general around here and in LA get into these long conversations when a little planning ahead of time would keep the frequency clear.  .


Listen more, talk less, and follow the proper radio procedures.  

My normal SOP for flying into a new uncontrolled airport is listen up on freq, come blowing into the break down low and eyeball the runway and terrain for visual checkpoints.

In today's environment with the WEB and sites that report airport data like www.airnav.com for free, there is no excuse for not knowing the local procedures and the airport.

Fun was back in my Navy days landing at more than a few uncontrolled airports in big birds picking up flight crews that had broken a bird.  Smoking in at 300 knots is fun.  :P


Just listening up on Unicom or tower freq 10-20 miles out helps your database.  Try to avoid reporting 10 or 20 miles out from the field too. Who cares when your that far out, it's in the pattern that counts.  

Always be leery while landing of folks rolling onto your active and forcing you into a wave off.  At my airport (FDK) I generally tried to avoid weekends during primetime.  We had biz jets using the long runway, GA using the crosswind runway, Medivac choppers lifting off, and glider ops.  I can't recall a midair in a decade or two.  Lots of close calls, but it worked out quite nicely.  Tower not required nor needed.

Jack

Offline Snappy

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2006, 12:21:49 PM »
The other day I was corrected on my pattern entry by a student pilot doing touch & go's at S50 (Auburn, WA).  I entered upwind and merged on the crosswind behind a Cherokee climbing out from his touch & go.  He told me the "best" way is to overfly the airport, then decend and enter on the 45.

I dissagree.  When entering the pattern of any non-controlled airport, I use the upwind when it is practical.  By using an offset upwind, you get to locate the existing traffic and best determine intentions using the radio.  "Cessna on downwind abeam, are you full stop?"  Then I always make blind position/intention broadcasts, "Auburn Traffic, Long Ez 8AB is downwind turning base for 34 number 2, full stop, behind the Cessna short final, Auburn".  By using the turn as your position, everyone else should be looking for your wings at the appropriate position in the pattern.

Also, by using the upwind entry it is easy to extend and merge without cutting in, and you are not decending and trying to merge on converging courses with the other guys doing the same thing!  I have seen rivets on the belly of a Cessna 414 who just blasted through the pattern.  Don't want to see that again!

The student was obviously parroting his instructor's lesson, but that is part of the problem.  Kinda like not teaching spins so that no one gets killed by them.  FAA nonsense.
Snappy
Long EZ 988AB

Offline maprather

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2006, 01:54:57 PM »
The offset upwind can be a very practical means of safe pattern entry depending on what direction you are going with respect to the runway in use.  If my course is within 45 deg of the runway orientation, the upwind is it.  If my course is more than 45 deg off, I do a perpendicular midfield to downwind, or a 45 to downwind.  

If landing at a field where there is not traffic nor wind condition reporting capability, I usually choose to stay at least 500ft above pattern altitude until I overfly the field and get a look at the wind direction indicator.  Depending on terrain/weather, surface wind conditions may be different than those at altitude.

Additionally, I believe the "45 to downwind entry" could be argued to be a contradiction to the AIM which states that all turns within the pattern should be in the same direction.  If left pattern, the turn from the 45 to downwind is to the right...


Matt-

Offline NWade

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2006, 02:13:21 PM »
Again - this is a Student Pilot speaking...

Steve,

The FAA can be maddening in the way it does things; but calling established procedures "nonsense" is a bit dangerous IMHO.

I agree with you that flying an offset upwind gives you a good way to observe the pattern while staying out of it - and then immediately merging into it smoothly.

However, there are several issues with doing this:

1) What about noise and hazards?  Many airports are set up with traffic patterns designed to keep the planes over one side of the airport as much as possible (occassionally for a good reason).  If you start overflying the other side in order to do an offset upwind, you negate all this.

2) Does this technique gain you anything (other than shaving maybe 5 minutes of flight time) that a quick over-flight at 1000' above pattern altitude doesn't?  The higher over-flight means less noise on the ground, less likelihood of a traffic conflict or close call with a pilot that's busy in the pattern (and not visually scanning like he should because he's busy), and less likelihood of coming close to a ground-based hazard near the airport.  We are taught that "higher is safer" in most aspects of flight.  Since the airport vicinity is home to a lot of traffic - AND a large portion of GA accidents - every safety advantage should be valued, in the eyes of this novice.  And if that extra 5 or 10 minutes is _truly_ a critical issue, then I think that pilot failed to adequately plan for their flight.

3) Tens of thousands of pilots are trained to expect traffic to merge in at a 45-degree angle on the downwind.  When they are on the departure/upwind/crosswind legs, they will be looking over there for traffic.  They will NOT be looking for a plane making an offset upwind on the opposite side of the airport, which may turn toward them or cross close in front of them (if they're still on the upwind when the non-standard-pattern pilot turns crosswind).  And since a departing pilot is probably departing in a Vx or Vy climb, visibility over the nose is going to be crappy for them.  Yes, all pilots are supposed to maintain a visual scan at all times; but we all know that when workload is high, the chances of spotting traffic are lower.  We're human and fallible.  Therefore the chances of spotting traffic where we expect it to be (on the 45-entry to the downwind) are much higher than the chances that traffic will be spotted when its NOT where it is expected to be.  As a plane entering the pattern in a non-standard method, you effectively remove the other pilot's eyes from the equation.  For most planes, this instantly halves the equipment being used to detect and avoid collisions in the air...

Again, I agree with you Steve that your idea is a cool technique - but unfortunately it goes against years of standard practice and official guidelines.  For better or worse, those guidelines were adopted and have been put into practice by thousands upon thousands of pilots.  As a computer professional, I've seen the "best solution" tossed aside for the "industry standard" time and time again - so I know its frustrating.  But since flying can entail life and death decisions, being safe may be better than being right.

Take care,

--Noel

Offline Drew

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2006, 05:10:47 PM »
Probably the most taught technique is the 45 to the downwind.  However, you can do a straight downwind entry, a crosswind entry, an upwind entry, a base entry and a midfield to the downwind entry.  Offset to the runway does not mean to fly a downwind on the opposite side.  All that means is that your nose is essentially lined up with the left or right edge of the runway (or a little more than that) so that you can see the runway as you pass overhead.  If I already know which way the pattern is running, I line up with the center of the runway for a upwind entry.  Flying offset like that is not a noise issue.  However, be aware of any noise procedures at that particular airfield-----you may not want to come into the upwind at max power if you are at a noise sensitive airport.

Depending on geometry, my 2 main preferences are a 45 to the downwind or an upwind entry (and pretty much use the upwind for the break----so max knots on upwind--unless traffic concerns).

I am only comfortable making all the other entries when I know that I am the only one in the pattern.  This is usually known when I get no answer on the radio, have to fly over the field 1000ft above pattern and look for the sock, and while there, notice no one else.  Then I just pick whichever entry is most convenient.  While all other entries are perfectly fine, I just  feel that they don't let you "scout" the area enough.  Everyone knows where the upwind leg is (right over the runway) so flying right for that is no big deal.  If any traffic is on that leg, you will see him.  But who knows where the downwind leg is---for a direct downwind entry?  If everyone flew nice tight patterns, you would have no problem spotting all the traffic.  But I would say that a majority of pilots fly way too far abeam (do you really think you can make the runway from all point in the pattern if you lose your engine?----If not, you are too far abeam).  When you fly too far abeam, you are too hard to spot-----Are you really in the pattern---or are you just flying "near" the airport at 1000 ft?  I was once flying downwind when evidently there was another guy on downwind----very far abeam.  Never heard him on the radio.  Just saw his wingflash when he was turning base----and cutting right in front of me---scary

The point is---that if you come from a 45, that gives you a better look at the downwind leg looking for traffic.  If you enter directly to the downwind (perfectly ok--but I am not comfortable unless alone in the pattern), who knows who is parallel to you?  Same for all the other legs but upwind.

For all the real old pilots out there------a straight in is perfectly fine too.  That change was made way back when.  I don't agree with it---but it is fine.  Usually the straight in guys disrupt the pattern----and usually get lots of people mad at them.

Oh---and from my prior post-----45s to anything other than midfield is not ok---you are just looking to kill yourself along with someone else
Drew Swenson
Cozy N171ML

Offline eric r

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2006, 08:39:23 PM »
I couldn't agree more! A 45 is an accident waiting to happen. I much prefer a crosswind at 1000 above pattern to observe the airport, the windsock, and the traffic. Unless there's a Lear or a Harmon Rocket on the departure you'll be clear of everyone. Those whoe rely on the radio and the unicom to get airport and traffic info are flying blind. The guy at the fuel desk doesn't know if there is a tractor on the runway!

Offline Snappy

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #9 on: May 27, 2006, 09:20:09 AM »
Hello guys, guess I should have been more exact on technique and procedures regarding the upwind and thoughts on the FAA.  For the most part the FAA does a good job and we of course would have an absolute mess without them!

But, as Drew pointed out there are other ways to enter the pattern than the 45 degee downwind.  And regarding spins (not a real problem for Ez's) if you are taught properly to enter and break a fully developed spin, you are a safer pilot and will instinctively know when you are about to enter one at low altitude or possibly in the pattern.  Each and every pilot, from the ATP to the 10 hour student (and we are ALL students) will benefit from an hour in a Pitts S2B with a competent instructor practicing spins and/or unusual attitudes.  What is your first instinct when you see the ground comming at you over/under the nose?  In an emergency, you will revert to your training and do what you were trained to do.  If you aren't trained then it's a crap shoot.

I have been lucky enough to be able to use my Long for business transportation and average about 250-300 hours a year covering the western states.  As a rule when traveling to major cities, I use non-towered airports because they are less busy and I can get in and out easily and fuel is a little cheaper.
Usually, when I'm about 10-20 miles out,  I listen in on the ATIS for basic information, then go from Approach Control to CTAF to see who is inbound/outbound, closed traffic, crop dusters working in the area or whatever.  The pattern entry is kind of like getting in line, if you butt in, everyone behind you gets miffed.  Proper entry will allow those behind you turning crosswind or early downwind to extend and let you in.

But you can't always see everyone!  Especially while decending and manuvering to get the 45 degree midfield entry while you have 2 more inbounds doing the same thing.  That's when it (to me) makes more sense to overfly at 500+ above pattern to see the sock and identify traffic.  Then, align for the offset upwind entry.  By adjusting your speed, you have the options of:
1. Entering the crosswind behind the aircraft taking off for another touch and go.
2. Making an early crosswind behind the aircraft taking off for another touch and go and following the aircraft already established on downwind.
3. Extending your upwind to allow the other inbounds to enter the pattern, whether they are 45 degree downwind or any other pattern leg.

Of course the object is for everyone to get down safely and without seeing rivets or swaping paint!  Our ability to see and avoid is directly related to how well we judge each entry and make the correct decision as to the best way to proceed.

Fly smart, be courteous and safe.  Get as much training doing 'different' things in airplanes as you can and you will be a better pilot!
Snappy
Long EZ 988AB

Offline eric r

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #10 on: May 27, 2006, 07:16:06 PM »
I guess the best advice is to follow the helicopter pilot's pattern rules: Avoid all traffic!!

Offline RyanHilliard

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2006, 12:50:13 AM »
I feel obligated to point out that the FAA has some advise on this subject:  Advisory Circular 90-66A - Recommended Standard Traffic Patterns for Aeronautical Operations at Airports without Operating Control Towers
(long, laborious link removed, just search for 90-66a on faa.gov)


A few key points (keeping in mind that this is recommended, and not "the law")

The only correct way to enter the pattern is 45 to the downwind.
The only correct ways to leave the pattern are straight out and a 45 off of the upwind.
Overfly the runway at 2000' AGL to check the windsock and wind tee (which should tell you what runway is in use) since bigger/heavier aircraft commonly use a 1500' AGL pattern altitude.
Never descend into the pattern!  Be at pattern altitude before you begin the 45 to downwind.



The idea here is that if everyone is playing by the same rules, it's a whole lot easier to spot traffic, and the flow of traffic is much more orderly...

Just my $0.02 worth.

Ryan

Offline Drew

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Don't be sloppy in the pattern---and expect the unexpected
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2006, 05:39:32 PM »
I suggest that you call the AOPA Air Safety Foundation and tell them how wrong they are in their Safety Advisor titled "Operations at Nontowered Airports."  Because they show more ways to enter the pattern than you describe.

Your key point is that they are recommended procedures.  Kind of weird to see recommended procedures turn into "...the only correct way..."  

The guy who tried to kill me did enter on the 45 (but not to midfield as you should) and did called his position as left traffic when he should have called right.

For those that don't have it handy.  The ASF PREFERRED method for entry is from the downwind side of the pattern on a course 45 deg to the downwind leg and join the pattern at midfield.  They also talk about coming from the other side and teardropping into the 45.  They also say that an alternate method is to enter on a midfield crosswind at pattern altitude, then turn to the downwind.  Give way to aircraft on the preferred 45 and to those already on downwind.

Also they state (for straight ins)....Though permissible, a straight in approach should only be used when you are certain there will be no conflict.  Stright ins should yield to other aircraft in the pattern.  If another aircraft is ahead of you on base and spacing will not be sufficient, go around by altering course to the right (on a standard left pattern), enter the upwind leg, and turn crosswid when its safe.

All in all, this is a good 14 page document that everyone should be familiar with.
Drew Swenson
Cozy N171ML