Long-ez rain canard

[LongEZBuyer]

I'm considering buying an older Long-EZ with the (Ronz?) canard that loses lift when wet.  Obviously, it takes a bit more back-pressure, but I've heard varying accounts as to how much and how bad it is.  It's likely I'd want to fly out of about 1000' of low clouds, maybe 10x/year, but I could avoid IMC (to the extent that one can plan/avoid it).

What's your experience flying Long-ez's with these canards?

[LongEZBuyer]

btw, I'm mainly asking for experience reports, but also analysis new since the canard pusher article on point (http://ez.org/cp35-p2.htm).

[Kilo42]

The canard you are refering to is the "GU" canard.  

The "Roncz" was designed to allow for better flight characteristics while flying through moisture.  You can recognize these canards by the swept up tips.

The "GU" canard tended to have a pitch down tendency when flying through moisture.  The amount of pitch down tendency varies from plane to plane.  Some are trimmable and some are more bullheaded.  

Vortex Generator kits are available for the GU to help prevent this tendency.

Roncz plans are still available from RAF and are considered an upgrade.

Hope this helps


Kilo42

[Anonymous]

I think it should first be said that the phenomenon you are asking about applies to Variezes as well (as they have the exact same canard [GU vs Roncz]); as such Varieze owners could be asked as well.  

My Varieze with the GU canard has a definite pitch-down when wet.  I've only gotten it wet one time as I don't like the idea of flying in rain (regardless of plane).  Note that I'm located in dry country to begin with.

When mine got wet I happened to have my hand on the stick...all of a sudden I needed to apply a fair amount of back pressure to maintain attitude.  I was at least a thousand lateral to a cloud and maybe 2-3k below it.  Suffice it to say I caught some of it's rain.   I was familiar with the GU's properties when wet...this was not disturbing in the least.

If I desired to fly in rain, I'd have no problem with the idea of installing the vortex generators on the canard and be done with it.   Same to be said if I was considering buying a LongEz with a GU canard.   The plane is safe to begin with using the GU canard; vortex generators will help you avoid you having to use your trim on those 10x flights per year.

[Drew]

For my Longez, I would go from full forward trim in cruise flight to full aft when flying through a cloud.  My first several years of only having a VFR cockpit (and flying quite a bit), I never had to experience any of these tendencies------did not fly in the rain and did not fly in the clouds.

Once I converted the cockpit to IFR, it was a requirement for me to put on vortex generators because of the pitching tendencies of my GU canard on my aircraft.  VGs are a cheap and easy fix for this phenomena.

[Tom]

I think the biggest thing to mention here is that all canards are not equal.

In the  CPs it is noted that some GU canards actually experience a pitch up change in rain..

My VE does nose over when wet but it is very controllable, and it doesnt really seem to matter how hard (or light) the rain is. If there is water, move the trim back an inch, that simple.

I would ask the owner of the plane you want to buy to take you for a ride in some rain, just to see first hand how it handles.. And then make your decision.

Have fun


Tom

[Guest 38]

My Varieze is one that will pitch up some with just the "smell of moisture"!  It is easily trimable. However, in heavy rain I will fly final about 10 mph faster and land a little hot.....just in case.

[Al Hodges]

I heard the stories and bought a Long-EZ with original canard in 1989.
Living in Floridq meant it was easy to find a rain shower. So I went flying.
My first test jerked the stick out of my hand, the plane lost 500 feet of
altitude, and I flew away to think and dry the canard.

Then test two: A firm grip retained the stick, pitch trim controlled the
tendency to dive from loss of laminar flow,  and there was no problem.

So I never bothered to get the Roncz revision.

Now, 16 years later, I still fly the original canard, touch the top of a cloud
now and then, got wet flying to and from Casa Grande Antique Air Show,
and felt the effect of moisture but still could control it.

Every homebuilt is different, so the result of moisture can only be known
by testing.

Remember, any aircraft can last a lifetime, if you are careless enough.

Al Hodges
El Cajon, CA

[Don]

Al  Hodges, I enjoyed talking to you at Casa Grande regarding the Longez.
visit my website  www.longez209.com

Don

[Dave in Eugene]

I 2nd the comment about more speed on final in the rain. Lots of folks comment about flying through a cloud or small amount of rain but my guess is most folks haven't landed in the rain. If your airplane pitches down in the rain then you have lost lift. If you loose lift then your stall speed has increased...ie.fly faster on final. The best option would be to complete a series of stall tests in the rain then 1.3 X Stall speed for approach...(right?)

VG's are under $100. I look forward to installing mine.  Dave

[Aussie EZ]

The extra speed needed on finals in the rain is very real. I have an 0-235 Long EZ with a Roncz canard. On entering rain, it pitches up very slightly.

One day while landing in a fairly heavy rain shower I slowed down through 65 knots while flaring just above the runway and was very surprised to see the nose do the classic pitch buck.      There was no damage done as the nose only dropped an inch or two in each oscillation and i wasnt really in a position to ease off the elevator too much or too quickly so close to the ground anyway. Despite all of this a reasonable landing was accomplished.

For comparison, in the dry with the same weight and balance the pitch buck would only occur at about 52 knots.

So these days, if it is raining at all, touch down speeds are kept above 70 knots.