Long EZ templates

[Desertdweller]

Good grief -  what is all the discussion about ?  Burt Rutan washed his hands of EZs long ago.  He could not care less of what you build, or what you call it (as Todd pointed out).  Just don't ask him for support.

[Todd Copeland]

That is an idea, can anyone confirm that the wings are the same on the Cozy? It seems that maybe the original Cozy, or maybe even the Cozy III, butsurely the Cozy VI has more wing area?
Todd

[rglos]

Are the plans really copywritten.

I checked out the US Copyright web site and they have an interesting search engine.

There is nothing on RAF or Rutan, Burt but there is something registered under Rutan, Dick

Check it out

http://www.copyright.gov/records/cohd.html

Main site is

http://www.copyright.gov/

Under FAQ's there are two areas dealing with plans or instructions

How do I protect my recipe?

Does copyright protect architecture?

[rutanfan]

I've often thought about this myself (after paying $750 for an unused Long-ez plans set & another $300 for the TERF CD-Rom.)

If I was going to build a Long-ez again, I'd purchase a licensed set of Cozy or Aerocad plans and the TERF-CD rom which contains all of the Long-ez plans except the A-size drawings. Then purchase the Long-ez molded spar and and foam from Aerocad.

[Anonymous]

But the A-size drawings contain more than just the airfoils. I have a list of what's on them, but not with me at the moment.

How to solve that problem? The Cozy dimensions will be different, so you won't be able to directly transfer them...are you suggesting that you reverse engineer from the Cozy back to a LongEZ (what Nat did, only backwards)?

I'd rather spend the $$$ for an unused set of LongEZ plans.

[1 guest]

Checkout this site  http://www.republicaerospace.com/  It's a Long-EZ and so much more. Frank

[rutanfan]

Quote: "But the A-size drawings contain more than just the airfoils. I have a list of what's on them, but not with me at the moment."

Exactly. You need the A-size drawings for assembly information. Otherwise you could simply purchase the TERF CD-ROM and build your Long-ez from that.

Quote: "How to solve that problem? The Cozy dimensions will be different, so you won't be able to directly transfer them...are you suggesting that you reverse engineer from the Cozy back to a LongEZ (what Nat did, only backwards)?"

No I'm suggesting you purchase the TERF CD-Rom (which you'll need anyway because you need the CP's) and purchase a set of Cozy plans, and purchase the cores & molded spars from Aerocad, which will save you 100's of hours and ultimately yield a lighter and stronger part. The TERF CD-ROM contains the Long-ez section I plans.

Quote: "I'd rather spend the $$$ for an unused set of LongEZ plans."

I believe the last unused set to sell on Ebay was about $1,200.  Plus $300 for the TERF CD-Rom. You can start building with no support for $1,500.

Buy the Cozy plans with CD news letter with full support for $520 & the TERF CD-Rom for $300 (Now you have two plane plans for less than the Long-ez plans.) You saved $700. The real doozy, however, is the cost of molded spars and pre-cut foam ($3240.)

[Anonymous]

For the record....

This subject comes up time and again, with the same tired but entirely valid arguments brought up.

The LongEz remains a desirable leading design.  Any talk of "too bad you were born late, find something else" should be shunned by genuine LongEz enthusists.

Bottom line:  if you've got the foam, glass, and glue laying around and are searching for a set of templates, AND if you've developed a good relationship in the Long community, someone will help you out in the template department.  On the other hand, if you're one of the countless people who shows up out of nowhere asking for templates, don't be surprised when no one steps forward to help.  There seems to be a disproportionate number of the latter group with a commensurate perenneal discussion about the difficulting of securing templates.

[Waiter]

Bottom line: if you've got the foam, glass, and glue laying around and are searching for a set of templates, AND if you've developed a good relationship in the Long community, someone will help you out in the template department. On the other hand, if you're one of the countless people who shows up out of nowhere asking for templates, don't be surprised when no one steps forward to help. There seems to be a disproportionate number of the latter group with a commensurate perenneal discussion about the difficulting of securing templates.

EXACTLY

Waiter

[Anonymous]

Rutanfan....

Perhaps you missed my point, or I missed yours.

The A drawings for the Long EZ:

A1 - Lower IP Template
 A2 - Upper IP Template
 A3 - F22 and Winglet Templates
 A4 - Firewall Templates
 A5 thru A8 - Fuselage side view Templates
 A9 thru A14 - Wing and Canard Templates and jigs and blocks

do not match in any respect the Cozy's M drawings. The dimensions are all different, correct?

Purchasing cores and spar from Aerocad eliminates A9 through A14, but does nothing for you when it comes to A1-A8.

You need those drawings, don't you?

Or are you saying you  will use the Cozy's M drawings as a guideline and guesstimate?

(PS: I do own a set of Cozy IV plans and the TERF CD.)

[Anonymous]

Why in heaven's name would you have thousands of dollars' worth of foam and glue, etc. "laying around" if you were not assured of being able to build an airplane from them?

This is putting the cart pretty far in front of the horse.

Is it not possible that a person would be entirely serious about building a LongEZ but entirely unwilling to buy all the supplies until they had some assurance that they'd actually be able to do so?

Exactly what constitutes the level of seriousness necessary to pass muster and get the community to help out with this?

Step 1 of building an airplane is gathering all the information necessary to do so. Does that mean you're "coming out of nowhere?"

I'm certainly willing to pay for information, because it doesn't go bad. I have bought the Cozy plans and newsletters, the TERF CD,  and all of the CSA newsletters. I participate in all of the forums and mailing lists I know of. I've managed to wrangle rides in both a Cozy IV and a LongEZ. Next weekend I'll get a look at a Cozy III and help disassemble it for transport. If there was anyone near me building, I'd be participating, but there isn't. I suppose I'm still an outsider coming from nowhere, though.

Maybe I'll  build a Cozy, since I've got the plans...but the LongEZ would, I think, suit my needs better. However, I'm stymied. I've tried to buy two projects, and had both snatched from underneath me. Perhaps I'll succeed one day...just gotta keep plugging, I guess.

[mwilli7119]

Maybe we should just all pool our money and try to buy the rights from RAF. Use the proceeds pf selling plans to support our habit.

[Anonymous]

Why in heaven's name would you have thousands of dollars' worth of foam and glue, etc. "laying around" if you were not assured of being able to build an airplane from them?

I haven't seen any recent ads posted on ez.org with someone looking for LongEz plans...yet there are people here complaining that they can't find plans.

Sets of original plans with templates come up frequently enough for sale here/ebay/barnstormers/etc that IF YOU WANT TO BUILD A LONGEZ you will be able to get plans without even contacting the Ez community.  I think it safe to generalize that most in the Ez community are quick to discount the "I can't find plans" pleas for help because most in the Ez community see plans/projects for sale on a regular basis.

A used set of LongEz plans was sold on Ebay this past week including 9 of 14 templates for $280.  People, this is less than they cost when sold new (in real dollars).  Usually the plans/projects are at VERY reasonable prices.  I personally assume (as do many others I'm sure) that many people seeking plans want them on the cheap rather than paying market prices...and that people with REAL interest in LongEz plans (ie people who will actually start to build) will pay the market price.

[Anonymous]

Actually, that set of LongEZ plans included the Templates for a VariEZ. Look at the photos very carefully.

Waiter

[Anonymous]

Actually, I DID submit a wanted ad for plans with templates a few weeks ago. It never appeared. I assumed that it did not pass muster with the moderator so I didn't resubmit.