Operating Weights for Varieze

[ryanwheless]

does any one operate thier varieze in the 1300 pound gross weight range?

[Joe Person]

1.  Did you build the Eze?

2.  If you did not, I'd stick with the current recommendations of Rutan Aircraft Factory regarding allowable weight.

3.  If you did build the Eze, you'd have to be certain that ALL primary structural layups (spars, shearwebs, BID pads in the wing fittings, skins, etc. are as perfect as humanly possible before considering high gross weight operations.

If you did not build the Eze, and the airplane is already placarded for a specific gross weight, you should not operate above that weight (The Feds don't like that).

I placarded my Eze at 1200 pounds.  I've only operated it there once, during flight testing.  I know my airplane inside and out, as I built it.  The spar/wing fitting interfaces are as good as they get, as are all structural aspects of the airframe overall.  Having worked airframe structures for 16 years, and having done a fair bit of structural analysis of the VariEze airframe out of curiosity, I'd shy away from 1300 pounds in a VariEze.  If you want that heavy an airplane, get a Long-EZ.   

My 2 bits.

-Joe Person
EAA Tech Counselor 4418
VariEze N79JN
Bothell, WA  (KPAE)

[ryanwheless]

joe,

no i did not buidl the eze.  after some research i am not going to buy an eze due to the weight issue.  i am however looking at a cozy IV
A Velocity Standard and a Glasair.  I am not a builder.  should i be concerned about purchasing an experimental aircraft.  i am not without total mechanical abillty however, i have not worked on many airplanes.

[Bruce Hughes]

Hi.   I assume that your name is Ryan

Buying a homebuilt is cheaper than building one or buying a certificated airplane.
You also get a better airplane than a certificated airplane.

You REALLY should talk with some of the CSA members face to face.   If you will tell me
where you live, I will tell you which members have which canard aircraft near you.   Then
you can look at one and get face-to-face coments.

The CSA has representatives in 30 states.   The smaller states like Rhode Island, Maine,
etc. are served by a larger one  nearby.   These state reps are VERY helpful people
and will be glad to talk (maybe give you a ride?) about canard pushers.

Where do you live?   You can call me at 808-250-0939.   Use Pacific daylight time when
you call....

Bruce

[Joe Person]

Bruce sez:

"Buying a homebuilt is cheaper than building one or buying a certificated airplane.
You also get a better airplane than a certificated airplane."

Begging to differ here.

I built two VariEzes for far less than what it would cost to have purchased them.  The old adage, "You can have it good, fast, or cheap - pick any two", goes a long way in the world of homebuilts, particularly plans-built airplanes.  The offset is that you have to spend time to build.  I'd rather spend the time to build (read:  "Learn") than the dollars to buy an airplane that was built (the vast majority of the time) by a total stranger.

This leads to my next point.

There is NO guarantee that any homebuilt is "better" than a certificated airplane.  On the contrary, I've seen plenty of homebuilts (both plans-built and "kit") that were not deserving of an Airworthiness Certificate.  Yes, there are homebuilts that could be positively deemed "better" than a certificated airplane, but this would have to include the ability to show that the airplane was better in all ways (i.e. comparing/evaluating the overall airplane against 14CFR Part 23, for example), and not just "better because it goes faster and costs less to operate".

I've seen homebuilts that were well-done, but that had engines and/or engine installations that were quite unsafe.

Building your own has some definite advantages.  You are the "whole enchilada" - you are the quality control officer, the fabricator, the assembler, the tester, etc., and (hopefully) you take great care & patience in doing everything as correct as possible.  I've seen these airplanes, where the builders not only build for the cost, but for the education of it all as well.

Assuming that a homebuilt that was constructed by someone else is a good, safe airplane is an unsound assumption, from my experience.

My 2 bits.

[Bruce Hughes]

I first went to OSH in 1992.   Saw a lot of Longezes and liked them.   Could have bought
one for around $28,000 and could have been flying since then.

So I bought a project that was almost done.   Thought I could finish it in 2 years.   I have
now been working on it for 15 years and I am 78 years old.   Will I ever fly it?  Don't know.
I have enjoyed the working but I think I would rather fly it.

I have made a LOT of mistakes in building.   Joe Person found a lot of them.   ALL of them?

NOBODY would buy the airplane that I have now.   Too heavy.   Looks bad.

I think it is safe and I think it will fly soon.   I have spent FAR MORE than $28,000 on it.
Maybe it is better than the ones I could have bought.   Probably not.

If you plan to build, recognize that it will take a VERY LONG time.   MAYBE you can do it at
less than the cost of a used one.   I doubt it.   Joe Person is an unusually gifted builder;
he builds light, safe, and strong.   I built heavy, maybe safe, and probably strong.
I think I am more typical of the average builder.

I think I can start the engine THIS WEEK.   Then I move it to an airport with a long runway.
We shall see.

Bruce 

[Drew]

I'll take it from a different approach.  Don't think that you will just get to fly your purchased EZ and not work on it.  At least if you buy the certified airplane, you will always find someone to fix it for you.  You can always get someone to fix your Lyc for you---but you are on your own on fixing the electrical and fuel systems---as well as any composite repairs.

Airplanes are not like cars---you will have to get work done at a much greater frequency than your car.  If you purchase an EZ---you will need to fall in love with getting your hands dirty and learn how to maintain and do repairs.  You will need to read the plans, so that you know the plane in and out----and you will need to read most of the Canard Pushers (Rutan Aircraft) or the Cozy newletters for the Cozy.  You don't need any building or repair skill prior to either building or owning.  If you can read, you can repair----but you have to have the desire to learn---and then do it.

If this does not seem appealing----then please don't get an EZ---you will be greatly disappointed.  Stick with a certified aircraft where you can more easily get a hired gun to work on it.

EZ flying is not just flying---it is a way of life---it needs to be in your bones.  I love it.

[GlennBob]

Drew  ole' buddy,

Don't break my heart ! ! !

I bought a '65  650 BSA motorcycle in 1973 as a basket case.  I was 16. I spent months rebuilding and customizing that thing until it was beautiful ! !   Then I took it for a ride.  Soon to find out, . .I spent more time repairing the dumb thing than riding it.  I STILL have it ! !  I tried selling it a few times, but never got close to what I had in it so it's holding the floor down in my shed.  When it runs, it's fast, but it's not reliable enough to take anywhere !   POINT IS : four years ago,  I bought my first EZ.  Sure didn't think it'd take this long to finish ! !   I hope when I'm done, . I won't spend much time fixin' it.  I understand there'll be some maintenance,  but I sure hope to put some miles under me for less than I spent on my Cherokee ! !    Tell me I didn't make a mistake ! !    ( P. S.  I DO  love the canard world ! ! )

Glennbob   

[cloudman]

About total operating weight...............
I have "Taken off" my C-85 powered Varieze at a fairly high gross weight of up to 1130 pounds, but like to burn off 16 gallons of gas before landing like on a cross country trip. Those times that I have taken a passenger up with enough gas to reach a similar weight, I like to land very softly to keep from stressing the plane/gear very much....and do not do it too often.

Those Variezes with LongEz gear should be able to handle the load better, but I would suggest landing a bit faster at high gross weights, like don't drop it in. Normally I land fairly slow and have made mods to allow me to do so..eg. vortilons, LongEz lower winglets and rear wing fences ........and the C-85 thrust at idle is less than larger engines.

About buying vs building a Varieze : Since you can not see the structure of our aircraft, I would much rather build than buy. Even if the plane had some hours on it, who knows if it had been stressed too much, some structural layers of glass omitted (which killed two people years ago with some of the layers attaching the winglets to the wings never installed), improper epoxy/hardner mixture, etc. I have seen builders working/building their planes with various distractions that can cause a potentially deadly accident later on, so it is easy to mess up. Do you trust your work and can build in a safe environment ?? Best be able to give an honest and safe answer to that question ! So buying or building a composite homebuilt is a gamble either way.

I have only flown two other Rutan aircraft built by others and that was with some reservation.

Cloudman....Wayne Johnson