Hangar Flying => Hangar Flying => Topic started by: allen on April 27, 2006, 07:23:48 AM
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: allen on April 27, 2006, 07:23:48 AM
29 days until I fly my new plane. The wait has been killing me! I have wanted one of these planes since I was a teenage airport rat at Mojave Airport. This still does not seem as if it is really happening. I suspect it will be “real” once I am heading back East sitting in the pointy end.
My sectionals arrived last night and I have begun planning the trip East to Virginia. Winslow, Monument Valley and the Grand Canyon are on the to-do list for the trip home. Any veterans out there with recommendations on a route?
I have been flying the Long-Ez in my MS flight simulator. I do not know if the flight dynamics are accurate, but it has certainly helped to get the sight picture down. I also have the POH and have been studying that for a few weeks now. I also purchased the new AirMap 600c with terrain awareness for the trip home.
Any recommendations on how I can help my transition? I’m trying to do everything I can short of getting actual stick time, and I’m working on that as well. I will be staying with the seller for a few days to get checked out and learn all I can before I leave. I have allotted 10 days to find my way home so that leaves some time to hang out in San Diego and just fly around getting familiar with the plane. We do plan on heading up to Big Bear and doing some high DA work as well. On the way back I plan on flying strictly day VFR and landing on nothing shorter than 5k.
I’m open to suggestions. There are plenty of gurus on this forum that have made the successful transition. How else can I prepare for the first flight, and how can I remain sane during the wait? 8)
Title: Transition
Post by: Charles Davis on April 27, 2006, 09:01:15 AM
I don't have much time in an EZ, but here are my suggestions: 1. Follow the Rutan suggestions; time in at least two different planes in the months leading up to your flight. I understand the Grumman Tiger mimicks the LongEZ pretty well. 2. I recommend X-Plane flight simulator over MS. It has a good LongEZ model available that you can tailor for your weight and HP. 3. The Long EZ is a remarkably well behaved airplane. Once you get the hang of it, it is no more difficult to fly than a C-172.
The EZ are pitch sensitive compared to Cessna's.
On takeoff, make sure you do not over-rotate. Keep the canard below the horizon!
During taxi tests, practice raising the nose and just holding it there.
On landing, don't flare like you do a regular airplane. Start the flare, and then ease (fly) the nosewheel onto the ground.
The EZ is aerodynamically very clean. Precise airspeed control on landing is critical. If you are only 5mph or so fast on landing, you will take a lot more runway!
An EZ won't stall, but don't let that make you complacent. They will achieve a very high rate of sink if you are too slow.
Hope this helps. Have fun. Fly safely.
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: NWade on April 27, 2006, 09:34:31 AM
This is a relatively low-time student pilot speaking; but I've taken a ride in a couple of EZs and am training in a Diamond DA-20 right now - its probably the closest thing I've found for a primary trainer (I've briefly flown a C-172 and a Piper Arrow; and both were Mack trucks by comparison).
The Diamond is a responsive little composite plane that doesn't like slowing down either (2nd notch of flaps are essentially speed-brakes). Its a tractor configuration with side-by-side seating; but it has a small center-mounted stick (not a yoke) and similar approach speeds (~65 kts). It is also hard to stall, mostly buffetting and occassionally trying to roll-off down around 30 kts; but no defined stall "break" and only a modest sink-rate during stall (with decent control effectiveness throughout).
Even though the view directly over the nose is blocked when you're the GIB, you might try to hop a couple of EZ rides here over the next couple of weeks - get a feel for the canard out in front and the "sight picture" of where it rests relative to the horizon in level flight and at approach/departure attitudes. Also, learning to NOT over-control the side-stick is important (see various CP's through the years for accidents relating to that). The EZ isn't "twitchy" - but compared to a Cessna or Piper, the stick deflections seem much smaller and take much less force. This is where playing a sim with a joystick helps; tuning your hand-eye coordination. Try to use mostly wrist control while playing the sim - don't "yank and bank" the joystick with your arm.
Good luck - and I am SOOOO jealous! :P
--Noel
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: swinn on April 27, 2006, 08:17:02 PM
Allen,
I'm in San Diego, building a LongEZ. There are a good number of local 'EZ' folks around. If you would like to chat, send me an email off my profile. I'm interested to hear whose plane you purchased!
--Scott
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: allen on April 28, 2006, 06:26:22 AM
28
I ordered a copy of X-Plane last night. However, my home computer is 4 years old so I may need to upgrade the video board in order to run this simulator. No worrys though, I have been looking for a reason to get the G4 for a while now.
Swinn, I sent you an email.
Title: Re: Transition
Post by: Jack on April 28, 2006, 08:44:56 AM
Quote from: "Charles Davis"
I
On landing, don't flare like you do a regular airplane. Start the flare, and then ease (fly) the nosewheel onto the ground.
The EZ is aerodynamically very clean. .
Whenever the nose wheel contacts the tarmac you want firm contact with it. It's real twitchy and you can lose the sucker in a heartbeat. When I take off, it's a clean break from the runway.
Unless your a real pro in flight testing, even taxi testing at speeds over 30 knots can be hairy. Ensure you have your egress procedures memorized, emergency procedures down pat and strap in tight for any taxi work.
It's a slick puppy in the pattern. Drop the nose a tad and it's 10 knots in a heartbeat.
I have flown my Long in 20 knots of direct crosswind before. Just have to fly it to the bitter end and add some knots. This is not for the faint hearted.
Good Luck;
Jack
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: allen on April 28, 2006, 09:19:19 AM
I am typing out and laminating my checklists and emergency checklists right now. I would be very interested to hear any personal checklists that are out there. Seems that every pilot has a tailored checklist of some degree or another usually the result of some event in the past that scared the hell out of someone. Things like the nose wheel shimmy are good pearls to plan for. :shock: Anyone who has a checklist that is willing to share I would love to have a look. You can email it to me at:
allen.crowder@hcahealthcare.com
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: Dave in Eugene on April 28, 2006, 02:59:22 PM
Allen,
my .02.
Remember when people say the plane won't stall that is a little missleading.. All wings stall. In an ez the canard stalls before the main wing. ( then the nose drops,some call it pitch bucking,... until it regains the correct Angle of Attack...
This is important to totally groc on landing. Do not come in slow...Do not come in slow, you do not want the canard to stall 6' above the runway... I've done it. ( in the rain with a GU canard...another story)
As long as you understand this and have a long runway you will be just fine... your mains will be firmly on the ground while you are flying the canard to the speed where it loses lift and sets down the nose wheel.
...and yes easy to over-rotate on take-off... Very light stick forces...Make sure your trim is set at the right place.
Don't be afraid to go around... i completly missed my 1st attempt at a 4,500' RW
Make sense?
Dave
Title: 29 days
Post by: Dennis on April 30, 2006, 04:24:43 PM
Whose plane did you buy? DM
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: allen on April 30, 2006, 09:10:34 PM
I purchased Al Hodges plane. He has put many hours on it and has done several cross country flights. It is a proven plane so I felt comfortable with it. Drew Swenson has really been helping me with the process. Saturday he came down and took me for a ride in his Cozy. The ride of a lifetime! Al has been great to work with as well. I look forward to meeting him finally.
25 days and a wake-up!
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: NWade on April 30, 2006, 10:21:06 PM
Allen - Good choice! I had the good fortune of meeting Al several times down at the Trio Avionics hangar when I was bumming around there at the end of '04... He's a great guy and you're getting a fun plane. If I'd had the money, I would've bought her first! :-P
If you think the Cozy was fun, just WAIT until you've seen the maneuverability of the Vari! 8)
Take care, and get prepped!
--Noel (...Trying to decide whether to become an EZ builder this winter; or an EZ buyer next summer)
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: Jeffco on May 01, 2006, 01:36:56 PM
I flew a Katana from about 5 hours just before I bought my Long ez. I had about 3 hours rear seat time before I soled her. The thing that was a suprise to me was that it felt like it was on rails. Not twitchy at all, but you don't need much movement to move her around. All the other coments are right on. One other thing, she is small inside so have your flight plan and paperwork ( sectionals ect. ) well organized. With GPS and a moving map display it makes things eaiser. Your gonna love it.
Jeff N141
Title: long ez
Post by: Jeffco on May 31, 2006, 02:20:15 PM
Allen So what happened. You seemed so excited to pick up Al's plane, now I read where you backed out. Why ? Would be interested to learn if you thought the aircraft was much different than you expected as far as handling and what not. Just wondering about your side of the story.
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: Drew on May 31, 2006, 04:56:12 PM
Jeff, I have not seen anything on any boards. Can you post what you have?---or give me a pointer to it?
Title: Long ez sale
Post by: Jeffco on June 02, 2006, 11:04:09 AM
Drew This is the post Al put up on the Yahoo Canard User group.
Before Selling:
In the process of selling my Long-EZ, an unusual circumstance occurred. A prospective buyer convinced me, in spite of less than 100 hours of flying experience, that he had dreamed of owning a Long-EZ since he was ten years old. Many hours with a Long-EZ simulator on a computer gave him confidence. Well, Wilbur and Orville did not have a CFI available, and they made it. I did not receive good advice and I made it, but I confess, I had about 1,000 hours more experience than Wilbur and Orville. So, we decided to give it a try.
He volunteered to send a non-refundable deposit to hold the plane off the market until he could fly to San Diego.
Before arriving in San Diego, I explained on the phone, the extra conditions we would require. My son recently purchased a Long- EZ. His experience transitioning from a Cherokee to the Long-EZ caused him to suggest using an “Orientation.” I will include this as an addendum for “2000 Ways to Fly a Canard” and post it on www.ez.org under Articles.
--------------
The final paragraphs are:
“After completing the testing and orientation steps above, if you do not feel completely comfortable taking delivery of and flying the Long-EZ, we offer to deliver it to your home base with you in the back seat. Your expense will be fuel, motel, and any other travel expenses, plus one airline ticket for return to San Diego.
I believe all reasonable attempts have been made to provide a thorough orientation in this aircraft, and feel my level of proficiency is sufficient for me to safely fly Long-EZ N____.
______________________________ Date ___________ Buyer
Witness: _____________________
-------------- -
Observations: The number of hours is less important than the mental attitude of the buyer. Flying hours experience contributes to a solid mental attitude and improves reaction when anything unusual occurs. This is more important than flying skill.
The first red flag: My buyer was very upset because the EZ lost the left magneto the evening before he arrived. His lack of experience meant he did not realize how lucky he was. 1) I paid for the new mag. 2) He did not have it fail during the trip back home that would have caused an unexpected expense, for hotels, meals, a new mag, and labor over a holiday weekend.
The next red flag: He kept asking everyone how to fly a Long-EZ. The intro booklet (“2000 Ways To Fly a Canard”), which he said he had read several times, combines over 175 years of EZ-pilots’ experience for maximum benefit. It did not take me long to comment, “I hope the last person he talks to gives him good advice.”
The next red flag: He seemed more interested in getting rides than learning. A former EZ pilot gave him a ride in a Lancair. I mentioned it would not help him in the Long-EZ, but his comment, “It will be an experience flying in a different airplane.”
At one point, he decided that the lack of certain details made him wary of the experimental aircraft, and he felt he should not buy this Long-EZ. My reaction was immediate. “If you are not comfortable, for any reason, do not buy the plane.” After making a few phone calls, he returned with a new decision, “I will buy the plane.” We scheduled a flight for the next morning, after which he would start taxi tests.
After the flight in the morning, he raised another red flag. After descending from over 6,000 feet to about 4,500 feet, I added power with a very lean mixture. His comment, “I was very nervous when the engine ran rough.” The rough engine lasted for as long as it took me to change the fuel mixture. However, give him credit, he flew the plane very well in a long climb with right and left turns. That was a green flag.
He was still going to buy the plane. When we returned to my house, about five o’clock, I said, “Let’s review the paper work.” He pulled out his phone, started a conversation, walked out the door, and disappeared for three hours. That was a little red flag.
When he returned, he said, “I have decided not to buy the plane.” In a way, that was a relief. There may be exceptions, but several hundred hours of flying experience seem to be a requirement before entering the Experimental field. If anything unusual would have occurred, his response could have been panic and fatal.
Final comment: Unless a person feels comfortable, they should not get a Long-EZ. This was my first experience under these conditions, and it was a learning experience. For over 17 years, I thought those other Long-EZ pilots were a strange breed.
Now, I looked in a mirror!
Al Hodges El Cajon, CA
Title: Supprised
Post by: Jeffco on June 02, 2006, 11:10:39 AM
Al dosn't know me from Adam I am sure, but I remember seeing his airplane and know it is a nice one. The thing about these aircraft, they are different than flying a Cessna or Piper. It took me a little while to get used to flying mine, but it did scare ma a little in the begenning. I think a little fear is a healthy thing though. I had about 700 hours total time when I purchased my Long but I don't think the number of hours are real important as long as realize that there is a huge responsibility in owning an aircraft. I hope Allen didn't make all his judgements from flying in the back seat. It's a word of difference up front. I would not hesitate to buy Al's plane if I was still looking. Someone out there will get a real nice bird.
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: Drew on June 02, 2006, 01:18:52 PM
Jeff, Not sure what you are talking about--but Al's airplane is very rough looking. From the pictures I have seen, it is not a particularly pretty airplane. (I think there might be another Hodges on the field that you may be thinking of---but not sure). Not even sure if the Gib can see out the canopy due to all the scratches. Now---if you are saying that the plane has good "bones"----ok if you say so. It is too hard from pictures to tell if it has good bones. Sometimes, even in person it is hard to tell if it has good bones (was that 7 layers of glass on the rudder or only 3?). But a good indicator of good bones is reputation of the builder (not sure who built Al's plane though). Beyond good bones is condition of the airplane as per the maint logs. How often did you change the oil, how much oil did the motor burn, are all the logs up to date. Lax logs mean lax maintenance. I have not seen those logs---but I (me) would not comment until I had. Is the plane airworthy as per FAA regs? Since the plane was built, did the plane have major mods----and were they properly documented? People have damaged planes---and insurance companies have refused to pay if major mods were done without proper documentation. How were conditionals being conducted? Are they properly signed off by either an A&P or the builder of that particular aircraft? What about all the documentation for the installed equipment? Is it there and complete. How about electrical diagrams, plans, CPs, templates, etc. Does it look like the owner has been well organized in keeping up with the aircraft as well as all the paperwork. All these things matter. Don't know where this particular plane stands----but all buyers should know these things before buying. You can always buy a "wreck" and fix it up. Just make sure you know what you are buying.
While there are quite a few people who actually learned to fly in the Longez, I would be somewhat nervous selling to a low time pilot. One of the things that you want to do----is that if you have lots of people wanting to buy your plane------the strategy is to sell to the person with the good combination of conservative flyer, experience, etc.
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: NWade on June 02, 2006, 02:40:53 PM
Its been 2 years since I last saw Al's plane... And you're right Drew - its hard to tell at a glance whether the layups are all correct. But that same argument cuts the other way when talking about paint & finish being an indicator as well...
However, I think the age and hours on Al's plane attest to its solid construction.
Heck, I'd be looking long and hard at buying the plane - if it weren't for the fact that I only have $7k in the bank right now! :-P
--Noel
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: Drew on June 02, 2006, 05:12:30 PM
Well...there was really 3 points I was trying to make.
-Jeff says the plane looks real nice. I say from the pictures, that it is probably one of the most beat longezs I have ever seen. If he is saying that it has good bones and has demonstrated airframe soundness due to hours/years----ok. Just trying to figure out where he is coming from.
-Properly built? Layers of glass? I say you can't tell without cutting it up and looking----so to be sure, you really have to know something about the builder. However, as you state----lots of hours/years on Al's airframe is probably proof enough that it has been properly built
-Properly maintained? I would walk away from a seller who does not know how to fix, maintain, or care for his EZ. I would walk away from a seller who can not demonstrate how the plane has been maintained. How often did you change oil, what maintenance has been done? Where is documentation of your condition inspections? Where is your electrical system schematic. How organized is your equipment list? etc
Not saying this was the case----but there is value to this.
Also, there is nothing wrong with buying a beat airplane----even one with no records at all. An EZ like this would be for the guys who don't want to build from scratch and are committed to getting the plane into the proper condition---and of course you would expect a bargain price for this too.
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: allen on June 02, 2006, 05:55:26 PM
There is much more to this story. I may give details later, but this will depend on how the seller decides to handle this situation from here forward. I have contacted an attorney and been advised to not air this out on the web at this time.
Allen
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: NWade on June 02, 2006, 06:38:23 PM
I'm sorry to hear that things degenerated to the point of hiring attorneys.
I won't take sides - especially since I know little about the airplane or this situation. However, I did hang out with Al several times in late '04 and found him to be a nice guy who was always pleasant to deal with.
It saddens me that the purchase didn't go smoothly; and I hope for the best possible outcome for all involved.
--Noel
Title: Als plane
Post by: Dennis on June 02, 2006, 07:29:42 PM
Al, So is it back on the market? I'll take some pics if you have some... Dennis
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: allen on June 12, 2006, 02:03:20 PM
Al’s plane is back on the market I believe. If you are interested in purchasing it I would strongly advise you to contact an independent A&P to perform a basic inspection. Do not use an A&P recommended by Mr. Hodges. Do not accept his latest conditional inspection as legitimate or even legal. Do not assume that the plane is fit for flight. Most importantly, be certain you have a signed contract before any money changes hands. Be certain that everything is in the contract. It would not be a bad idea to have it looked at by an attorney ahead of time. Do not accept any "favors" as reason for delays in signing the contract. Good luck.
Title: 29 days until I pick up my plane.
Post by: Waiter on June 12, 2006, 04:34:22 PM
Allen, Al, et al;
I have a saying that fits this application: "Trust Everyone, But Cut the Cards".
Allens advice should be applied to anyone, purchasing any airplane. When I sold my Cherokee and again when I sold my Mooney, I encouraged all prospective buyers to do exactly as suggested.